By Tom Burnett
I intend to testify on Wednesday. This is my prepared statement.
(1) Ladies and gentlemen, with all due respect. I come before you today to provide a reality check. The fact exists that it is implicit in the Hawaiian culture to be respectful and not say things people don’t want to hear. But, sometimes, that fails as a strategy. It does so today, when the government goes off on the wrong track and either politeness or political ideology propels the train off the cliff instead of stopping it.
(2) We all, and it is not a secret, understand that each of you believe you were elected because of your great campaigning abilities and your vision of the future of Hawaii County. Some were elected because they believe their districts are not getting it’s fair share of the pie, and you want more pie. That is the nature of politics.
(3) However, there is another open secret in this county. You, and EACH of you, were elected, not for your sterling abilities, of which I do not doubt. You were elected to get rid of the person you replaced because of the pitiful job they did. That is the reality.
(4) Further, this is a County Council, not a jury or a parole board. Your job is to make the lives of the people you serve as easy as possible and grace them with all of the benefits of liberty and the pursuit of happiness you can. Your job is NOT to sit behind closed doors and try to find ways to make life more unpleasant for the citizens. Simply being elected does not mean you automatically gain superior knowledge and become infallible – it merelt means you are less repugnant to the voters than someone else.
(5) As an example: Unless I am badly mistaken, we are gathered here today to consider, among other things, the mandatory removal of plastic grocery – and, presumably, trash bags, eventually, from the citizens of the rainiest city in the United States. Logic dictates that this is one of the places the use of such bags should be mandated. The simple fact is that neither cloth, which absorbs water ans molds, nor paper, which disintegrates in water, nor any other reasonably available substance will allow a person – especially a single mother with children – to shop for a family and get the groceries home in the rain.
I come from a generation in which paper bags were all that was available. The complaint then was that their use destroyed the forests. That is still true. But I also remember the nightmare of trying to get a cart full of groceries, in paper bags, into my mom’s car in the rain. The bags broke and we lost a lot of food, not to mention making a huge mess in the parking lot and in my car. Then, when we got home, the bags had melted completely, and it was almost impossible to get the food inside – ESPECIALLY things that were not canned. Cereal, for instance. Pasta. Fresh bread. It was all ruined.
(6) Therefore, ladies and gentlemen, I ask you to think about where you are and what you are proposing. This is not El Paso, Texas. Look outside. Go to the store and buy groceries for your family. Ask for ‘paper’. Then try to get it home. This is of the few places in the country where plastic is necessary, and should be mandated – and you want to ban it for impractical and non-sensical ideologies. Then, after a rainy winter, you think you will be re-elected because of brilliant decisions like this one.
(7) In closing, I thank you for your time and leave you with a thought. You have exactly the same power here to repeal the ridiculous actions of the people you replaced as you do to make yet more ridiculous choices which will cause you to be replaced in turn. Please consider repealing laws, not making new ones all the time. There are too many laws and we are not criminals. Until you pass another law. I seem to recall that a law was passed banning smoking in a car containing a minor. Watch the police drop their kids at school. They are smoking in the car. What was accomplished? Almost the entire council was tossed out. Learn when to say ‘when’.
A hui hou, kakoa
Thomas C. Burnett
PO Box 2051
Pahoa, HI 96778
December 20th, 2011 at 8:10 am
How about this option: get a WATERPROOF, REUSABLE eco-bag! For this rthe “paper-bags-disintegrate-in-the-rain” argument doesn’t “hold water”, if you’ll pardon the pun… (Sorry, couldn’t resist!
I would love to see us reduce/eliminate plastic bag usage on the island, but legally banning it just doesn’t seem like the best approach. It’s been mentioned here before, but I believe a more effective way to skin this cat is by having stores charge folks for plastic bags. It would definitely help me remember to pack my WATERPROOF bag before I go shopping.
December 20th, 2011 at 8:15 am
*Edit above, should read: “…For this REASON the “paper-bags-disintegrate-in-the-rain” argument doesn’t hold water…”
(Note to self: no more posting before first cup of coffee.)
December 20th, 2011 at 8:18 am
Thanks, Tim.
You’re right about the re-usable bags — our family has been doing that for more than 15 years. The film plastic bags are not a necessity, and are -destructive in the environment.
Likewise, the option of charging for film plastic shopping bags needs consideration — that is something testimony should emphasize.
December 20th, 2011 at 9:06 am
I have some heavy duty washable plastic bags.
Work like a charm. Wipe with bleach and water once in a while or when needed.
No problem.
December 20th, 2011 at 9:07 am
Seattle’s City Council just banned plastic bags, and instituted a charge of 5 cents for each paper bag…
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/20/us/seattle-bans-plastic-bags-and-sets-a-5-cent-charge-for-paper.html?_r=1&ref=us
December 20th, 2011 at 9:39 am
There are so many factual errors in this statement, it’s hard to know where to begin. The idea that trash bags are included in the “Plastic bag reduction bill” is typical of the mis-information from those opposing the bill. And try telling my customers that they cannot get their groceries home without throwaway plastic bags; They’ll be surprised, as they’ve been doing so for years.
Maybe it doesn’t rain on Maui and Kauai, where similar plastic reduction bills are already in effect, with wide acceptance.
It’s ironic to see people standing on their God-given right to trash the environment.
December 20th, 2011 at 11:33 am
First of all, it’s not a “ban”, but a reduction. Second, paper bags are not the only alternative to plastic: there are really nice shopping bags available in canvas, heavy-duty cotton, and recycled plastic, and they come in a wide variety of sizes, styles and colors. I have not used plastic shopping bags for many years, and will continue to not use them. The annual rainfall at my home is 200″ a year, and my shopping bags don’t disintegrate – neither do they break under heavy loads, unlike plastic bags. It is really not so hard to change the way you do things as you might imagine. Isn’t keeping the aina litter-free and reducing your petro-chemical footprint a good enough incentive?
December 20th, 2011 at 1:22 pm
You supporters can be as “green” as you want, but you have NO right to FORCE everyone else to participate in your faith-based beliefs.
This plastic bag ban will not make the world “greener”, only more tightly dogmatically controlled.
It will indeed make every one work just a little harder, suffer just a little more, cost a little more, all for nothing.
All wrong in so many ways.
Auwe.
December 20th, 2011 at 1:47 pm
“All for nothing?”
Yes, let’s not lift a finger or inconvenience ourselves in the least to save the environment. God obviously created this wonderful world for one generation to selfishly trash. Use it up and throw it away… I’m sure future generations will understand; We, the chosen ones, cannot be inconvenienced!
December 20th, 2011 at 1:49 pm
Anybody ever shopped at Costco?
They don’t use any bags plastic or paper and their customers seem to keep going back.
What’s up with that? Costco making everyone work just a little harder, suffer just a little more, cost a little more, all for nothing?
December 20th, 2011 at 2:35 pm
You folks might want to read up on some of the latest research.
http://www.insideronline.org/summary.cfm?id=16335
Cotton bags are much more harmful to the environment than the plastic bags they replace.Another point is plastic bags are now made mostly from natural gas,not oil.
Our elected officials should be trying to provide us with the means to easily recycle the bags that we don’t reuse multiple times and provide incentives for companies that use the bags to produce other useful products.
I have hundreds of square feet of decking that wraps around my house.It is all made from recycled grocery bags and rice hulls.I guess if plastic bags are banned I can always go back to using redwood or maybe koa for decking that holds up in our environment.
December 20th, 2011 at 3:18 pm
Plastic bags on Hawaii Island are not recycled and do not become decking. Many go into the ocean where some choke and strangle sea life caught in them, and others break down into particles that adsorb toxins and are swallowed by sea life some of which eventually gets consumed by humans, toxins and all. Many more are in the landfills for years and years and years to come, breaking into particles that pollute the groundwater. Many more of the bags, especially on the windward side, blow into the vegetation where the rain flattens them and they disintegrate into particles that are harmful to soil and animals.
It is the use of plastic bags that is an imposition on other people by forcing them to suffer the wastefulness and destructiveness resulting from that use.
December 20th, 2011 at 3:29 pm
Outgoing councilman Col Pete has not had it right very often. He’s right on this one, Give him his day.
December 20th, 2011 at 4:34 pm
Let’s ban styrofoam while we’re at it. See more of that along the highway than almost anything else. Bring your own cup.
December 20th, 2011 at 4:38 pm
Lets cut to the heart of the matter:
ban people, then NO litter at all, totally green !
That would also resolve the (green) human self-loathing completely.
Problems solved, all of them ! Happy Day !
December 20th, 2011 at 4:42 pm
re: Ms. Alves’s suggestion, I could go for that.
Or we could stop the trashing. Either way, OK by me.
Happy Holidays, All!
December 20th, 2011 at 4:53 pm
James,
That was the point of my post.The county council should be trying to find ways to recycle our waste and make useful products out of it.Plastic grocery bags are a very small part of the overall problem.Education of the public is a lot more intelligent choice !
Would you like to come down here to my neighborhood so I can show you what is really polluting the ocean ?
It is not bags !!
For every bag,I can show you several water bottles,thousands of feet of fishing line and the remains of nets.
December 20th, 2011 at 5:17 pm
has anyone been in Subway over the past 6 months? they got rid of plastic bags on their own, and now use a paper bags for the sandwiches…
December 20th, 2011 at 5:21 pm
So Ms Alves..you say that “green” supporters have no right in forcing their “faith-based beliefs” on others…
I’m not sure protecting the environment is considered a “faith-based belief” in the same way that people who are against abortion or gay marriage is…
December 20th, 2011 at 5:27 pm
My response to the argument that reusable cloth bags grow mold would be; “So does my underwear and socks when I don’t wash them”
December 20th, 2011 at 5:39 pm
Thanks, Greg, best entry of the lot.
December 20th, 2011 at 6:23 pm
The Mayor will have the last say….just like Mayor Kim…
December 20th, 2011 at 6:25 pm
And when you wash your cloth bag,do you wash it alone or with your moldy underwear ?
E-Coli would be more of a worry !
How do you reconcile the fact that many people on the Big Island don’t have hot water ?
It is really going to be convenient to build a fire and heat water to sterilize cloth bags.
Can’t we just find a way to make the plastic bags work ???
December 20th, 2011 at 7:08 pm
I like the idea… unfortunately there are too many loopholes in laws like this.
You can’t tell a store they can’t sell something that is a legal product… and your never going to be able to make plastic bags an illegal product.
What will stop stores from selling plastic grocery bags at the register for say a penny each?
When you start regulating the sales of legal products that stores can and cannot sell… it’s a bit too much of intervention in my eyes.
I like the idea of a bag ban… but then do you also tell merchants they aren’t allowed to sell the bags?
Or tell merchants they can’t sell things that are enclosed in plastic?
As much as I like the idea… I’d hate to be the person to tell Jeff Hunt Surfboards that they can’t sell surf wax because it’s covered in plastic that may lead to the ocean when surfers are waxing their boards.
December 20th, 2011 at 7:58 pm
any idea if stores in Maui are considering selling plastic bags? Is there something that would have stopped them? I mean, is the bag ban law there covering such a thing? A fine for doing so, perhaps?
December 20th, 2011 at 8:12 pm
Once upon a time, there were no plastic bags, and discarded plastic bags did not harm the environment and wildlife.
Even before back then, humans recognized what the earth did for them, and cared for the earth in return.
I don’t sell them, but if just one discarded plastic bag that I sold ended up painfully killing a honu or a mountain pig, I would feel like shit. Wouldn’t you?
December 20th, 2011 at 11:45 pm
I loved this guest column.
I would like to say to Russell Ruderman, that I have spent thousands of dollars in your store over the last several years. I am a really good customer, and I am tired of the employee attitude I get if I want a simple BAG when I have just spent $200.
Yes I have bought two Island Naturals Bags, neither of which can hold the weight of bottles well. Your system may work for people who buy a few things, but a lot of people in East Hawai’i like to do stock up type shopping. I don’t want to have to bring in ten reusable bags.
Your employees (with one notable exception) are really bad at dealing with a customer’s purchases, have no sense of how to pack any kind of box or bag, and they seem to feel that once it is rung and I pay, their part of helping is over. At some other market, I get customer service all the way to the door. I get baggers who know how to pack in a sensible way. But your prices are much higher!
I now decline your funky cardboard boxes, because I found a cockroach colony hitchhiked in with one. The same thing with Costco. Their boxes are roach-infested. They hide in the seams.
If I sound mad, it is to see you talking up your system, when I have been getting more and more exasperated with the non-service at your registers, and the stupid fanatical attitude that it’s a terrible thing for the planet to bag purchases.
Tom Burnett is right on, it’s very unpleasant to get home with a lot of groceries in pouring rain and paper does not work. Island Natural bags don’t keep things dry. Sometimes the bags need to be tied at the top for the groceries to make it in without the packaging getting wet.
Here’s an idea: when groceries all come in packaging that can get wet without damaging the food, I won’t need bags that seal.
These film bags do fall apart/decompose. I had a big store of them that were some months old, and got them out and there was nothing left of them but flakes, even though they had been in a nice dry cupboard.
To our Council — PLEASE let us decide as individuals whether we want bags, and if any of you imposes a per bag price, I’m surely not voting for you again. The plastic bags of the old days used to be sturdy, but the ones they use now aren’t. They serve the purpose of getting the stuff from car to house and MAYBE one more use, so I do not want to get charged for these junk bags.
Thanks for listening.
I just wish our representatives would put this same energy into bigger problems that face us.
December 21st, 2011 at 5:00 am
It always amazes me how something so immaterial to our daily lives becomes so material.
This bag ban can do NOTHING but help the environment. Sure, you can rationalize anything to say that the replacements will pollute more – but in reality this is something that will produce more people against it than will vote for the next President of the USA.
It is coming to places like Los Angeles. It’s already in the surrounding cities of LA. It is reality. Accept it. It has nothing to do with your convenience, it is not a religious based agenda, and it just quite frankly is one small step that makes sense in the right direction.
Imagine the grocery store your great grandma shopped in. Now go bitch about no plastic bags at Safeway.
Get real. Get smart. And quite frankly, just shut up!
December 21st, 2011 at 6:49 am
The bag-ban plague, the Green Death :
it came from Europe, then the mainland, to Maui, and Kauai, and now it’s at our door.
Bring out your dead & abandon hope in individual choice, and God have mercy on us wretches.
This is how personal liberty dies, step by step, until we decide to fight back against the rats and blood-sucking fleas.
December 21st, 2011 at 7:10 am
While I appreciate reading contrary opinions,I do not accept made up history. Mayor Kim (former) never acted on the plastic bag ban. That is too fresh in the memory box to be anything but distortion.
December 21st, 2011 at 8:08 am
Let’s see…what can we ban next?
Hey…how about condoms…yea that’s it,… condoms
In days of old when Nights were bold and condoms weren’t invented
what was used to stop the ooze and how were the socials prevented?
Ban condoms…they are baby killers…there are many other ways that are greener and safer to the un-conceived child.
Another idea…lets put a ban on new and stupid laws…make it against the law to make a new law without repealing an old and useless law.
The Lack
December 21st, 2011 at 8:18 am
Um, Hugh Clark…It seems extremely unlikely that former Managing Director Dixie Kaetsu could have signed the plastic bag veto without Harry Kim’s permission. And even if she did, Harry was ultimately responsible.
Dixie was right to veto the bill, though. Ordinary Maui residents hate the bag ban. The councilman who pushed it hardest on Maui left office, and lucky for him he did. He would have been hammered in the next election if he had stood for re-election after the Maui bag ban passed.
Our council members had better beware today. Even with all of the press generated by the Big Island proposal, most voters won’t realize what’s going on until the ban actually takes effect. That’s exactly what happened on Maui, and it was ugly.
December 21st, 2011 at 8:27 am
I have always supported Tiffany’s earlier suggestion that stores charge .25-.50 cents for each plastic bag instead of an outright ban. The proceeds would go to recycling efforts.
Those of us with hot water could wash our reusable cloth bags(What’s that all about, obie? I actually launder with cold water), and those of us who are worried about our right to a disposable lifestyle would pay a little to subsidize recycling efforts.
December 21st, 2011 at 12:17 pm
Hey Tom Burnett, Could you really read all that out loud in the 3 minutes allotted? Bet you get cut off.
The future of banned materials in the USA:
http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-january-3-2011/san-francisco-s-happy-meal-ban
December 21st, 2011 at 1:27 pm
I don’t believe this ban would stand a chance of passing if it were put to a vote at a general election. The Council should pass resolutions that the citizens would vote for.
General votes are cumbersome, so we have a council to act on our behalf, but it is still their job to represent the people, and if they pass a ban that I don’t want, I’ll vote to have someone new in office who might represent the many over the few.
The proposal to charge .25-.50 per bag is way too much. That’s a $5.00 surcharge on a typical family grocery trip, too much. Then you have the problem that baggers decide how many to use, but if they’re charging us, then we should have a voice in how the bagging gets done, and the stores wouldn’t like that. Plus the stores won’t lower their prices. The stores currently use flimsy bags that are not strong enough to hold very much. If you want to charge for bags, make them use bags that are strong enough to reuse.
When Island Naturals went bagless, it didn’t lower the prices. It gave less service for the same price, and then the checkers actually quibble over giving the reusable bag credit of an entire nickel.
I have gone in there and spent $10-20 and taken my reusable bag, and then they have refused to give the bag credit because what I bought didn’t FILL the bag. Amazing that a store will alienate a regular customer (or any customer) over a nickel.
I don’t want to deal with that type of mentality at the other stores. But I do like the idea of offering bag credits as an incentive to consumers. Reward, don’t penalize.
Ken, don’t compare this to LA. It almost never rains there.
December 21st, 2011 at 2:51 pm
well…
the bill PASSED !
5 in favor…Hoffman, Ford, Smart, Pilago, Blass
3 against…Onishi, Ikeda, Yoshimoto
Yagong recused himself
So, I guess that means Bill 17 goes to the Mayor…and if he vetoes it, there aren’t enough votes to over-ride it…
Let’s hope Mayor Kenoi follows up by signing it into law…
December 21st, 2011 at 3:24 pm
Onishi, the Councilmember from KTA, who called for the extra 6 months of public hearings in a cynical delay tactic, (“we need to hear from the public”) did not attend while testimony was heard, did not listen to a single word of testimony! Then he voted “no.”
Ikeda, when confronted with my petition of 1,090 signatures, had the nerve to accuse me of making up names! He said “I don’t see any names I recognize.” With over 500 Hilo residents signing, this is statistically impossible. He also said there were “some duplicates.” There were none!
How can he see duplicates if he doesn’t recognize any names? A photographic memory, with a computer in his head? And yet he didn’t recognize any of 500 Hilo names?
What an outrageous fabricator of disinformation. I’m glad he’s gone soon.
Yoshimoto did his usual “I like the idea, but the bill is not perfect, so I’m voting against it.” Wishy washy lame slogans to excuse lack of action.
Disgusting, those 3!
But, most importantly, Kudos & Mahalo to all 5 who originally supported the Bill. None flopped. Now it’s up the the Mayor to side with the environment.
December 21st, 2011 at 4:02 pm
Dittos on hoping Billy K like Harry Kim vetoes this turkey of an abuse of power.
Here’s an independent business opportunity for kids:
sell plastic bags for 1-cent each, in bunches of 10, outside EVERY store. Nature will find a way.
PS: Green Death? Rats and blood-sucking fleas? I LOVE it, KY ! Too true.
December 21st, 2011 at 4:38 pm
Mayor Kim was on vacation and his then managing Director Bill Takaba vetoed it for him…please know that it had to have been Harry’s decision that Takaba was carrying out…..
December 21st, 2011 at 4:40 pm
Wow, a war on Island Naturals! Man, it’s getting personal.
Here’s another point of view: we’ve had nothing but great experiences at Island Naturals. If we didn’t, trust me, we’d never go back. (And no, we are not affiliated in any way with I.N. other than being occasional customers.)
But can’t argue that some of I.N.’s goods are indeed pricey. Yet other items are very reasonable if you look for deals and plan. (We tend to go on the 20%-off days, etc.) Did I mention the lilikoi cheesecake is to die for?
As for I.N.’s service, we’re always greeted with a smile, and the cashiers are consistently kind and helpful.
While I don’t believe a legal ban is the way to go, I’m happy to relinquish my God-given right to trash the earth with plastic bags that I don’t NEED, if I can make even an small contribution to reducing pollution. I think a $.25-$.50 bag fee would be a reasonable way to fund a viable recycling program–or maybe even feed some hungry kids. More important for me, a pricey bag fee would go a long way in helping this absentminded old fart NOT forget his waterproof eco-bags.
Regarding the cockroach-infested boxes, here’s an idea: how about checking under the flaps before taking the boxes home?
December 21st, 2011 at 5:28 pm
sorry Takaba was finance director with Kim….hard to keep up when they get recycled so many times..in any case the managing director during Kim’s administration vetoed the bill and ther were’t enoght votes fir an override…HANA HOU!!!
December 21st, 2011 at 5:32 pm
As clarification, Bill Takaba was Finance Director for Harry Kim. He is Managing Director for Billy Kenoi.
December 21st, 2011 at 6:16 pm
It’s not a war on I.N., just something that has bothered me for a while. I loved the staff at the old store, but some of the newbies are not so great. My opinion as a customer. The lady with the red hair is priceless (sorry, I know her name and am blanking).
>>> Regarding the cockroach-infested boxes, here’s an idea: how about checking under the flaps before taking the boxes home?
Seriously? So AFTER the “bagger” packs the groceries into the box, I should go outside, take the groceries out, check the flaps, then repack? Because if I don’t do it then, the roaches are in my vehicle.
What is the point of having them box groceries if not so the customer can actually carry groceries from store to car to house?
Maybe the STORE should check the boxes for roaches before putting my food in them? Those little German roaches are a pain and I don’t like importing them.
I am a vigilant recycler, but I don’t like this ban. It is too Big Brother.
December 21st, 2011 at 7:31 pm
Not to continue a major detour from the plastic bag ban, but I have to question if Ellen even shops at IN because what she is describing doesn’t match up to what I have consistently seen.
Point 1: Island Naturals’ current reusable bags come with a lifetime promise of replacement when they wear out and are very sturdy, waterproof, and cleanable. All the Big Island grocery stores went through a learning curve on the reusable bags, the early KTA bags were junk too, but market demand resulting in new products, and now all the stores are offering better quality bags.
Point 2: I have never had an IN checker go get a box for my groceries, I always walk over, pick the box I want, and check it out on my way back to the counter to make sure it is clean. But I do not expect boutique style service from a natural food store in Hilo or Pahoa, or anywhere for that matter. It just isn’t what they do. I do expect quality local and organic food with a minimum of chemicals and additives. Maybe Ellen needs to evaluate if IN meets her need for personal service from checkers, but they are pretty much the same as every other natural food store I’ve ever been in. All natural food stores seem to have a certain “greener than thou” vibe coming off certain employees and customers, usually the younger ones who just discovered a whole new lifestyle and are a little dogmatic and over zealous. This is not unique to IN, college town food coops are the worst about this, and it can be really annoying. No one wants to be vibed while spending their hard earned money on high priced groceries, but it isn’t really worth an internet diatribe.
Russell made a conscious decision to not add single use disposable plastic film bags to the local environment, and to delay the entry of cardboard boxes into the waste stream by encouraging customers to reuse them to cart home their groceries (we then use ours to take recycling to the transfer station and then recycle them). He probably made that decision based on a combination of bottom line and personal ethics. That willingness to walk his talk makes me more likely to patronize his stores, not less, even if I do have to deal with starry eyed 20 somethings doing yoga stretches in the produce section when I just want to grab some things for dinner after working all day.
The world functioned for many, many years without plastic grocery bags, they have only been in use for about 25 years. The Chicken Little hysteria coming from the pro-plastic bag set is over the top. We have seen a steady erosion of our constitutional rights ever since the Red scare witch hunts of the 50s; the right to privacy in one’s person, home and communications has virtually disappeared over the last decade, and plastic bags are what gets people’s knickers in a twist?
December 21st, 2011 at 8:30 pm
Amen, csgray.
Particularly the last paragraph.
December 21st, 2011 at 9:08 pm
Tom, very entertaining. They cannot fix the roads or the water or the sewage or the landfill or poor hospitals or poor schools. So let us focus on the real culprit plastic bags.)
December 21st, 2011 at 10:14 pm
The necessary changeover brought on by banning lead in plumbing, paint, and gasoline, similarly caused some griping and inconvenience too.
December 21st, 2011 at 11:40 pm
Four things Seattle and the Big Island have in common…
Rain…
Coffee…(our is way better)
Lowest Law Enforcement Priority of Cannabis (but in Seattle they actually enforce it)
and, now a plastic bag reduction act ! nice
December 22nd, 2011 at 8:11 am
I heard NOTHING coming from the pro-bag-baners about what they expect tourists to do when they shop. Are they to pack bags in their luggage to spend precious fuel to fly recycle bags around the world? How are they to know to bring bags?
This has not been a well thought out process.
I find myself uncomfortable surrounded by the 3 that voted “No”.
December 22nd, 2011 at 8:23 am
If I see one blue haired old lady leaving the bueaty shop in the rain with a plastic bag over her head….I’M CALLING THE COPS
The Lack
December 22nd, 2011 at 8:43 am
Ignorance is bliss, one would guess.
December 22nd, 2011 at 12:54 pm
csgray,
I am disappointed to see go into personal attack mode, question that I ever shopped at IN, thought you were intelligent and better than that type of argument.
Yes, I have been a customer of the Hilo IN for roughly a decade, spending about $200 a month there for much of that, and don’t appreciate being called a liar.
I bought their reusable bags the first week they offered them too.
Don’t appreciate the lecture on natural foods stores either. Have been going to them since I was five years old (taken by mom), back in the days when starry-eyed greenies weren’t the ones in the aisles. Have shopped in them my entire adult life in various states and locations — so your condescending intro to how they work is not needed or appreciated.
I believe that any store needs to have good customer service and lay off the supercilious ideology. Like one time I asked staff a question about a coffee they used to carry, and I was told by the staffer “I don’t drink coffee.” End of story, coffee was not in this employee’s realm as he had made a personal decision not to drink it, so no interest in helping the customer — even though the store sells coffee!
Ideology in a business can be annoying and off-putting.
Internet critique is called for when the owner isn’t visible in the store, but is posting about how great his way is in this article. OK, that’s off my list now, and yes, as you suggest, I can shop elsewhere for most things and have been doing so of late.
csgray wrote:
>>> The Chicken Little hysteria coming from the pro-plastic bag set is over the top. We have seen a steady erosion of our constitutional rights ever since the Red scare witch hunts of the 50s; the right to privacy in one’s person, home and communications has virtually disappeared over the last decade, and plastic bags are what gets people’s knickers in a twist?
What a horrible argument coming from a teacher! I have not expressed my complacency with losing any of these rights, but you make an unfounded leap to claim that I am only “in a twist” about the plastic bags.
On the contrary, my earlier post suggested that there were more important problems facing us than the plastic bag issue, although my take on it differed than yours, in that I suggested the Council apply themselves to bigger fish and not waste so much energy on whether or not we can have bags if we want them.
There is no “Chicken Little” hysteria on my part. I said I don’t want the ban or support it passing,and I said why. I did not say it was the end of civilization as we know it. Again, classic poor argumentation to hugely exaggerate the position of those disagreeing with you. The folks who are making claims about how the planet will suffer hugely (i.e. Chicken Little) are in the anti-bag camp.
I can adapt to this ban, but I don’t like that it passed, and it is certainly my right to agree with the author of this guest column.
I am not here to make war on a business either, but it is my right to call a business owner out on patting himself on the back in public here, when my LONG experience with his business is that it is getting less customer friendly, and a wake-up call might be a good thing. Maybe he wants to lose some of his “mainstream” clientele who spend well, and plans to keep the doors open on the cash of the young and starry-eyed (and you, a happy camper with his system). If that works, good for him that he can afford to lose steady customers.
To be clear, I bought the recycling bags, and use them most of the time, but I get attitude when I have occasionally run out the door and forgotten them, and it’s a turn-off.
December 22nd, 2011 at 2:31 pm
Mahalo to the five, I DO appreciate my neanderthal self being drug into the 21st century.
December 22nd, 2011 at 10:14 pm
“This is how personal liberty dies, step by step, until we decide to fight back against the rats and blood-sucking fleas.”
No, this is how liberty died: S1867
December 23rd, 2011 at 7:32 am
I encourage Mayor Kenoi to veto the ban. Put the matter on the ballot in the next election and let the people decide the issue, not five individuals.
December 23rd, 2011 at 8:37 am
Didn’t the people decide? Wasn’t the majority of the testifiers in favor of the ban?
December 23rd, 2011 at 8:43 am
Why yes Tia. Every damn one of your liberties will have been stripped away if Kenoi has the balls to sign this into law.
But at the same time, you are perfectly fine with 86 year old grandmas being strip search at airports.
I guess furthermore, the tourists who come here must be really more dumber than the ones who already go to Seattle, or say Long Beach, CA – where the bag ban has already been enacted.
December 23rd, 2011 at 8:49 am
tia, you are correct in both your 2 most recent posts.
Thank you for your re-emphasis of the point.
December 23rd, 2011 at 9:04 am
Ken, you should really look at S1867, then watch Naomi Wolf: End of America (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjALf12PAWc). It will make your toes curl and all this plastic ban issue will look like petty child’s play. If you really want to get angry, join the rest of us and get out there and do something. The shit’s about to hit the fan.
December 23rd, 2011 at 9:16 am
it seems the Honolulu City Council is now going to take up the issue
http://www.civilbeat.com/articles/2011/12/23/14313-honolulu-council-chair-to-push-plastic-bag-ban/
Just shows how out of touch Ikeda, Yoshimoto and Onishi are…
December 23rd, 2011 at 9:35 am
Ikeda, Yoshimoto and Onishi do what they are told… as does Kenoi.
All of them are tasked with maintaining the status quo.
December 23rd, 2011 at 10:51 am
Ellen,
I’m sorry about your bad experiences at Island Naturals. We don’t want anyone to feel under-served or neglected. I would love to get more details, try to fix them, and see if we can resolve this with you.
Please email me so I can discuss this with you.
russell@islandnaturals.com
To the others, thank you for your support.
December 23rd, 2011 at 12:16 pm
Speaking of grandma getting striped searched and little children getting fondled at the airport, don’t just say it’s NOT OK, do something about it!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Qdb6wC0Iz4 Grandma Got Molested At The Airport
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ek1uqrwLmQk&feature=player_embedded Grandma Got Indefinitely Detained (A Very TSA Christmas)
December 23rd, 2011 at 12:31 pm
Always.
I heart Island Naturals, particularly the Pahoa store managed by Kai Sorte.
December 23rd, 2011 at 4:23 pm
Aloha Russell,
sure I will email you.
Obviously if I shop at the store for years to exclusion of all other natural food stores in my area, I do like the store.
If I didn’t like it, I wouldn’t bother to point out irritations. Good to know you are willing to hear about them.
On another note, I asked a Safeway checker yesterday if they (checker staff) have discussed how to handle a bag ban, and she said, no, she has no idea what they will do, and was wondering when it would take effect.
December 24th, 2011 at 6:58 pm
Considering that 1) Safeway has stores on Maui, where there’s a bag ban already, and 2) they gave away reusable bags for the opening of the new store, I don’t think we really need to worry about whether they’ll be able to deal with it.
I’ll just be happy that I won’t have to tell them three times that no, I DON’T need a plastic bag when I can fit everything into my backpack, or when I’m only buying one thing.